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Kurt Eckhardt's avatar

Except for a year away for college and another year on Wall Street, my first 44 years were spent in the Edgewater neighborhood of Chicago. I considered myself the ultimate Chicagoan. My dad and then I were Bear season ticket holders, I went to dozens of Cub games, concerts, street fairs, rode the L, walked the alleys, caught rays on the beaches, played softball, traded on both futures exchanges and then became the 48th Ward GOP Committeeman. I ate and drank from Hegewisch to Hyde Park to Beverly to Edison Park. Indeed, Chicago was the largest part of my identity. But then, suddenly, in the early aughts I noticed a profound difference in the city-and even, in the North Shore suburbs. While the city had long been Democrat, Chicago had always leaned a bit Right. No one ever confused a Daley for a leftist. However, each passing year, old school Chicagoans either made their way to Heaven, Arizona or suburbs in the Daily Herald's coverage area. They were replaced by a million or so La Raza, sex freaks who were forced out of their hometowns in Iowa, and liberal arts majors from Madison who wound up as northside baristas. Gone were the capital risking traders, hard working factory workers and common sense tavern owners. Finally, in 2005, I moved to South Florida to be close to my parents and not only have I never looked back, I'm flat out disdainful toward those who remain.

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Illinois Entrepreneur's avatar

I am a lifelong Chicagoan, and have done just about everything you can do in the city -- like you.

Now, even though I live in the burbs (we moved to get away from the riots of Floyd), I despise the city. I have met and tangled with a number of the machine Democrats because of my business, and I just don't like most of them as human beings. They are vindictive, militant, cold and calculating.

I am trying to get out, but still have a couple years before I am fully liquidated from business and real estate assets. The business and real estate market in Chicago is bad, because everyone knows how difficult it is to do business there. The city is not growing, and more vacancies continue to appear.

The politics of the base has turned to a mean, hard left NIMBY'ism for just about everything. There isn't much excitement in the city anymore.

The only question for me is where to go, because I enjoy the seasons and changing weather. It also has to be free of Democrat control and totalitarianism.

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Ataraxis's avatar

Western North Carolina. Low taxes, great people, and perfect four season weather with no extremes..

Our 6 months of warm weather temperatures mirror Chicago’s, except for the extreme heat and humidity Chicago gets. That doesn’t happen here with our Blue Ridge Mountain weather. I rarely have to run my air conditioner, and the temperatures cool off every night because of the mountains.

Our 6 months of colder weather is where we deviate from Chicago’s. November to April our daily highs are 10-15 degrees warmer than Chicago. We rarely get snow, and if we do it melts in a few days. We also have some winters with no snow.

The best part of winter here is that you do not have to hibernate at all. Our daily highs rarely fall below 32 degrees, so you can be outside in the sun on most winter days. I usually only wear a fleece or very light jacket in the winter. All my Arctic clothing from Chicago has been in a box since I moved here 5 years ago.

Regarding taxes, because the Republicans control the legislature, and because the NC governor’s office is the weakest of all 50 states (by design since 1789), taxes have been dropping. We are at 4.25% this year and dropping to 3.99% next year. If further budgetary surpluses are met, the rate could drop to 2.5% eventually.

Another great feature. Western NC is only a one day’s drive to Chicago, New Orleans, Washington DC, or Tampa Bay. So vacation spots are not limited to Wisconsin or Michigan.

FYI all searches for a place to move to have to start at the county level before you can drill down to a town. This is because of local taxes and voting trends. My search started by looking for a red county with low taxes. One of the reasons I picked the county I’m in is because the last Dem president they voted for here was FDR. My county is a bit bigger than DuPage County, but we have 1 million less people. This is great because there’s no traffic with the low density, yet we still have a large enough population to have great amenities. Amazingly, I get better medical care here than I did living in DuPage. Turns out the high quality of life here is a draw for good doctors.

One final thing. Everyone is polite here with good manners, even our homeless people. That might be because of our high rate of gun ownership. As a local once told me, “Assume that every pickup truck you see has a gun in it.”

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Illinois Entrepreneur's avatar

This is great. I know a lot of people who've moved to Tennessee, Florida, Arizona, Texas. I know one couple who moved to North Carolina and they seem to love it. It seems a bit under the radar but potentially a great choice. I like that the healthcare is great, as I am not getting any younger.

Thanks for the description -- it is something I will keep in the back of my mind. Our decision will be coming soon enough.

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Ataraxis's avatar

One thing to note, even in beautiful areas, the smaller urban areas can ruin a nice county, just like the Dems in Chicago ruined the rest of Illinois. Every urban area brings urban problems, that’s why I ended up in a county where the biggest town has only 15,000 people. When I retired I was done dealing with urban problems and urban behavior forever. I wanted to live with my tribe.

Case in point on urban problems. Asheville NC is one county away from me. Great restaurants, scenic views, nice downtown, and oh yeah, in the top 10% of most violent US cities. And they had to call in the National Guard during the Floyd riots. And they hate their cops, so many left. There are beautiful parts in the county Asheville is in, but the leftists hold sway over the entire county and there’s nothing the rural people can do about it. It’s really sad. If you like urban areas, just do your homework on the neighborhoods and taxes and crime. I just happened to adapt to semi rural living, but it’s not for everyone.

The county I’m in has seen what’s happened In Asheville’s county so we’re doing the opposite. The residents of my county who moved here from the north have openly said “the leftists ruined where I used to live, but we’re not going to let them ruin this county, because we’re not moving again.”

I looked at Arizona but it was too far away from Chicago and my family for me. Florida is too hot and buggy for me. We have people in my area who retired to Florida but then moved to NC after experiencing Florida. Tennessee is great with no income tax, but stay away from Nashville, it’s too crowded, has horrible traffic, and is full of leftists.

When you start your research, this is a great site: https://datausa.io/

For crime statistics I just query Perplexity AI. I recently used it for a Midwest road trip to see if the various places I was staying were in safe areas.

Good luck!

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Illinois Entrepreneur's avatar

Great advice, thank you!

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Victoria's avatar

Please stay away. People in rural areas are hurt by relatively wealthy retirees pushing up land prices and voting bluer than the locals.

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Whosher's avatar

Respectfully, I hear the same thing about folks from NorCal moving in. I’m one of them but you can’t be wary of all of us as all my friends and my family are dang conservative. We’ll help, when you live in the belly of the beast, you can see ‘em coming a long way off.

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Ataraxis's avatar

It’s not a zero sum game.

The influx of money into my county from the retirees lifted the economic opportunities for all the locals.

This is easily proven by going to a county close by that does not have an influx of Northerners.

There’s a stark difference between those counties and the one I live in.

The choice is economic vitality or economic stagnation.

The town of 15,000 near me has the amenities of a much larger town. Money did that.

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Earl Camembert's avatar

I've mentioned before, but I'm scouting NW Indiana - I have family that won't move, but it's actually easier/faster to drive from Munster or Merrillville to the Chicago south burbs than it is from the north side of the city.

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Rascal Nick Of's avatar

This makes me sad. Being from Wi, Chicago was always such great and exciting city to visit. Now its a commie hellhole. Well, Rudy Giuliani was able to turn around NYC. Make Chicago Great Again!

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Mike Zimmerman's avatar

I'm with you, Kurt. I moved to Naples in '04. Ahhhhh. It feels good. It's sad what Chicago has become, and I feel sorry for the people who stayed or thought they had to stay, like my in-laws. Oh well, we can't save them all...

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Patricia J.'s avatar

I was born at St. Francis Hospital in Evanston (as was Hillary Clinton). Now people go there for gunshot wound treatment.

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NNTX's avatar

I spent about 7 years coming to Chicago 1-2X month in the late 80's-early 90's. It was FANTASTIC then and I actually preferred it to NYC, where I worked for a number of years before and after.

The architecture, dining scene, lakefront, theater and comedy and business climate (my clients) were vibrant and exciting. So sad that it has been ruined by far left pols.

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Scott Garl's avatar

Both your and Jeff's take on Chicago always leave me breathless, thanks for sharing.

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Tom Elia's avatar

I lived at 1618 West Thorndale until I was almost nine years-old. Went to St. Gregory’s until we moved to the suburbs in 1969.

I played pinners with my buddies all spring and summer long using the ledge of a blocked up window on the side of a tavern at Clark & Thorndale. Summers of ‘66, ‘67, and ‘68….

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Earl Camembert's avatar

"They were replaced by a million or so La Raza, sex freaks who were forced out of their hometowns in Iowa, and liberal arts majors from Madison who wound up as northside baristas."

Very, very true - the old ethnic enclaves, the thriving parochial school system, even the local precinct captain/fixer, the corner tavern that was actually on a residential side street - all gone. Hell, try asking someone "what parish are you from?" and you'll be greeted with a blank stare.

When I walk down my street, I see far more trans "pride" flags and "Hand Off Chicago" signs than I do American flags. So at least you know where their allegiance is.

(I just want to see if local houses that had "Brandon Johnson for Mayor" signs up a couple of years ago will have the f'ing nerve to post new ones when it's re-election time.)

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Dan Sleezer's avatar

I’ve offered my Illinois State Representative (a real Democrat kook) a drive tour of my old neighborhood, Austin, for a real look at welfare state policies, but she turned me down. She’s a ‘silver spoon’ loon who has the full support of the Illinois Democratic Super Majority because she’s a ‘useful idiot’ for them! DuPage County has been taken over by AWFLs.

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Tom Elia's avatar

I wrote this for another post by Glenn Reynolds, but I think it fits here too:

“As a former Chicagoan, I am worried about what Chicago/Cook County Democrats might do next.

“Experience teaches us that if a Chicago/Cook County Democrat is actually in compliance with the law, any law, it is probably temporary, and almost certainly a coincidence.”

What Chicago/Cook County Democrats have been doing in/to Chicago the last few decades just sucks.

Every last one of them should go jump in the f—-ing lake.

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Patricia J.'s avatar

Great post. The old bargain was: We keep electing Daley, he keeps the crime contained. But that doesn't exist any more. I don't think a lot of my Dem family there understand that yet. Even in Oakbrook, the PD said they arrested 96 Venezuelan thieves in 2024.

As far as immigration, what shocks me the most is the professional global orgs that are embezzling from govt programs or making billions off the (unrestricted) drug and sex trades, not Juan and Maria coming for a better life. And I think the pols are making money with the gangs, who are now as professional as the mafia was, and don't want to stop. https://www.chicagomag.com/chicago-magazine/january-2012/gangs-and-politicians-an-unholy-alliance/

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Jeffrey Carter's avatar

Wait. I am told by Nunya illegals aren't an issue

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Danimal28's avatar

Democrats have always used violence starting in around 1860(KKK) through Jim Crow, eugenics along the way to the eco-population-bomb terrorists of the 60/70s, the Weathermen of the 70s and now in its current form of 'Antifa'.

I live 40 miles from MPLS and have zero reason to ever go there again until changes happen; my company who has been headquartered there for 100 years has moved to Dayton, MN. The city cared not even though they are now going to lose an annual $300M in corporate taxes alone.

I have zero reason to visit ChiTown either even though Buddy Guy's Blues Legends was one of our staples.

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Beckster's avatar

Dayton, MN was the subject of a recent article in the Minnesota Star Tribune. The gist was that Dayton was a rural stronghold but is rapidly growing with businesses moving in (such as your company) and new housing developments with a focus on larger lots. I only look at the Strib's website b/c I grew up in Robbinsdale MN and lived in an apartment by Lake of the Isles after graduating from the UofM. And then left for California for grad school and never returned :)

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Danimal28's avatar

Too bad the major cities in Cali are worse than here and Minny follows all the Cali mad policies with glee.

Pretty weird that Cali votes for republicans 40% of the time and only control 9/52 House seats there. Gerrymandering anyone?

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Beckster's avatar

Yes, I lived in Oakland CA for 33 years and bailed to the Central Coast (Paso Robles area) in 2015. I think Minnesota is actually "outdoing" California at this point! But leaving the state in the next few years, looking at ID or TN. And yes, we are 40% of the population in terms of voting and it looks like Prop 50 will win by a 2-1 margin next month. So we'll have even fewer seats. Anecdotally, looking at my Nextdoor convos, what's selling Prop 50 for liberals is their hatred of Trump and the fact that this prop is 'temporary'.......which it isn't, the new gerrymandering will stay in place but after the 2030 census, the so-called independent commission will be re-installed. Oy Vey. What a mess.

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Patricia J.'s avatar

The Dems I think have purposely demonized Republicans since their great "triumph" of getting Nixon to resign. And it's working.

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Danimal28's avatar

Indeed, they did the same to Nixon as Trump. Woodward worked in Naval Intelligence, not the media; notice how VP Agnew was pushed out in favor of the Warren Commission Ford?

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Kurt Slentz's avatar

Selective application of the law was the Biden administration's Forte. It gave them the power to only enforce those laws that ran contrary to their agenda. That so much of the country seemed to accept what they were doing was very telling, and deeply disturbing. Career politicians are definitely a bane on American society.

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David Cole's avatar

This was outstanding and spot on.

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Ed W999's avatar

Liberals love to say crime,corruption, antifa and many other evils don't exist. If they don't exist, they cannot be attacked which has always been the Democrat's plan.

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JC's avatar

I left the city of Chicago in 2006 and now live in Sydney. While Australia has its problems like any other place, I’ve never regretted the move. When you live in a chaotic place like Chicago, you tell yourself this is what life is like and become numb to it all. It’s not until you get some separation that you open your eyes and see the sheer amount of lunacy you put up with to live there.

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Jeffrey Carter's avatar

People we knew, including us were often scared to simply go walk their dog

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Ron Sandack's avatar

So much good information here. Thanks, Jeff. A couple of thoughts. First, it pains me that LinkedIn has become Facebook, that just sucks. Another point is that I now doubt Illinois can conceivably out-grow the pension liabilities. Ever. Last, Ted Dabrowski could forget more about Illinois' economic and political challenges than most could hope to learn. That said, I hate that thoughtful, voting Republicans are either disappearing to other states or are too busy planning to bolt to help him get elected.

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Jeffrey Carter's avatar

There is no way to outgrow them in Illinois. None.

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JBP's avatar

I would give outgrowth a shot, if we had a sane political system in Illinois. We have a massive technical university in Champaign and an AG industry (and AG academia) that is by-far world-beating.

The problem is we don't have a sane political system. For example, Illinois (and the U of I) spent more resources fighting with Marc Andreesen than they ever did trying to work out some plan for tech business to locate here. So how many businesses did we lose? Netscape, Twitter, Facebook, AirBnB, Stripe just for a start. Oh and PayPal.

They love a fight and want their cut from any legit business. So legit business leaves town and we are left with the nitwits at Rivian, Gotion and other politically connected companies.

Just drove by a huge solar farm near Decatur. Blown over in a tornado a few months ago. Sits there in ruins waiting for the next government bailout.

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Ken Mitchell's avatar

There are SEVERAL term limits that we need to impose.

First, we need to limit how long people suck on the government teat. Starting from age 20, anybody who wants to run for public office needs to have spent at least half of their adult life working for a paycheck with a PRIVATE enterprise. By age 40, the candidate must have spent at least 10 years in the private sector. Government SERVICE isn’t supposed to be a lifetime career; serve the nation for a FEW years, and then go back to the farm.

Second, there are 330 million people in America; we shouldn't keep electing the same losers. No candidate may run for ANY Federal office who is a close relative (spouse, partner, parent, grandparent, sibling, 1st or 2nd cousin, child or grandchild) of any President, VP, Governor or Senator. No more Kennedys or Shrubs or Clintons or Romneys or Cuomos. We need NEW "elites"!

And finally, we need a maximum allowable tenancy in Washington, D.C. Every government official or employee of ANY kind may reside within 100 miles of Washington D.C. for a maximum of 20 years. Work for the government for a SHORT WHILE and then GO HOME. I would especially apply that to congressional staffers, who accumulate in D.C. like soot.

And since the leftist "judges" would rule that all this was unconstitutional, it needs to be a Constitutional amendment.

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Rascal Nick Of's avatar

Great post. I thought it was pretty notable about democrat billionaire Mark Benioff saying Trump should send the national guard to San Francisco. Its odd for a variety if reasons. Not the least of which is that his support for communists running his city would be one of the main reasons that needs to happen. These people are somehow selectively blind to cause and effect. How long until Cali runs him out of the state too? Also, we need to be removing about 1 million illegals per month. I dont see how at this point.

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Burton M's avatar

I'm sorry to hear about Dan Rahill's passing last year. I did not know him well but our paths did cross a few years ago. He came across as genuine and someone I would have like to work with.

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Mitch Weiner's avatar

Chicago has a blatantly racist Mayor who wore a keffiyeh to a press conference and has made absurd, ludicrous racially ignorant comments. He is an admitted tool of The Chicago Teachers Union, a group so radical they publicly bemoaned the death this month of a terrorist. Living in an unincorporated area of the southwest suburbs, it is still Crook County, so I'm impacted negatively and it's Illinois, so of course I'm impacted negatively, but the city of Chicago, which I once went to nearly weekly and had lived in for multiple years, just will not get my business more than a few times a year, instead of a few times a month. What I have witnessed and heard and read is shameful and sad.

For the past seven or eight years, I called out former prosecuting attorney Kim Foxx for being on the receiving end of bribes from drug dealing gang leaders and cartels in the form of stable coins, crypto in numerically coded "unnamed" wallets and insisted she be investigated.

My requests got nowhere.

I know for a fact it was true.

Yet nobody, and I mean nobody, around here was willing to step up and do so, so I let it go. Not a coincidence she chose to step down this time around, because she saw the writing on the wall.

Right now the federal government has its hands full with all the scumbag Democrats on the left who need to be investigated and criminally charged and she just is not that high of a priority now that she is out of office.

Just look at Michigan Avenue, the ones fabulous Magnificent Mile. 40% of the business is there have left over the past decade. At night it is essentially controlled by punks and gangs and during the day almost nobody wants to hang out there. There are times there there are exceptions to the rule, but it is a hollow shell of what it once was and that is entirely on the leftist policies that have destroyed a once great City. The shame of it is that media is cooperative with the left because they are part of the cabal and by the time they choose to address it, it will probably be too late.

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Mark Fox's avatar

Only about a month or two left, then I'm gone to Florida! I'm sad to move away since I've spent my whole life here except for 4 years in college. My grandkids (Including the newest, Bailey Marie, born last Tuesday!) are all in the Chicago suburbs. But I can always come back to visit and they can come down for a free and warm vacation.

I have gone into the city only a few times in the last 3 years to meet friends and it's sad to see the deterioration that's happened. Also, the traffic is still awful and everywhere you go, the parking rates are crazy!

You're right Jeff, the Dems have only made things worse with their bad policies!

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